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Psychotic Stewie :(

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Post by Jay Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:36 pm

dizzylynn wrote:Some adults see things too, and kids, I believe in mediums just no the idiots on tv. I think you have to be in a certain frame of mind to see more, hard to put it in words what I mean.

I completely go with this - and as I cant' explain what some mediums do, I have no right to admonsh them, nor would I.

But this "I think you have to be in a certain frame of mind to see more" doesn't answer the question, it's just a personal perspective - what is it about us that prevents us from seeing the same things as other animals?

Do animals also have to be in a certian frame of mind to see these things as well, in your opinion?


Last edited by Jay on Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:37 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Thumper2001 Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:37 pm

dizzylynn wrote:I believe in entities not ghosts as such, but we dont just die and go nowhere some stick around I think.
I'm with Lynn on this Thumbs Up

I don't like the term "ghost"
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Post by Jay Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:40 pm

I have no argment one way or the other for ghosts or entities. But if you already believe in these entities, then it's likely that you will match your beliefs to each circumstance you encounter - perfectly natural human thing to do Smile

At the risk of souinding bullish, which I don't mean to (it's only text - so you can't hear how I'm sayng this, but it is with genuine respect for what you're saying, all of you) -I repeat the question - why can't we all see or experience these entities, the same as other animals do?
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Post by icedancer Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:48 pm

From what started out quite interesting has turned a bit agressive! I shared my spooky experiences and from my point of view they are true. I wouldn't come onto a forum and make them up!

We know that animals have much better senses than us, better hearing, sight, smell etc. They can do things we can't, and vicer versa. They know things are going to happen before they do, my two can sense the slightest movement from upstairs and get excited.

I don't think we can really compare us to animals. We've just got completely different makeup
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Post by cheryl'n'bruce'flo Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:53 pm

I think it is also difficult to bring in animals to this discussion. I can see when Bruce or Flo has reacted to something, and I don't always know what that is. And sometimes, as Jay described, Bruce in particular can maintain that reaction for a long period of time. But I still do not know what he has reacted to. And this is where the 'ghost' as something unexplained comes in. He has reacted - it is unexplained - I say it must be a ghost. I am going to reiterate I don't know what it was. Bruce cannot tell me, I only know he reacted. I am fairly intune with my rabbits and often know something is up by the most minor change in behaviour. But it is only my sleuthing that can determine what is wrong. If it is 7.30 and they come and stare at me it is fairly probable that I have not got around to feeding them yet and they expect feeding at 7. I can make that link because when I feed them they stop staring at me. But when Bruce or indeed Rocky next door spends hours nervously thumping I generally have no clue what that is about. As human I can ask fellow humans what their experience was and they can tell me in great detail and having ruled out everything out the ghost explaination may seem realistic. However Bruce cannot tell me what he has experienced, all he can communicate to me is that he is nervous and frightened. Expanding on Jay's thoughts; Flo is often not the least bit bothered by whatever has freaked Bruce in most instances. She will just carry on as normal. If it is a ghost and animals can see them why does it not bother her? I am reasonable sure her hearing is better than Bruce's but her eyesight is worse. Therefore sleuth that I am says that Bruce saw something that scared him -a cat, a hawk, a flash - that Flo did not. I don't believe that the he is seeing ghosts. But I don't know as he cannot tell me.

BTW I do not mean this agressively and I don't believe Jay does either. As far as I see it, it is a discussion of ideas and beliefs.
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Post by Jay Mon Feb 20, 2012 12:58 pm

icedancer wrote:From what started out quite interesting has turned a bit agressive! I shared my spooky experiences and from my point of view they are true. I wouldn't come onto a forum and make them up!

We know that animals have much better senses than us, better hearing, sight, smell etc. They can do things we can't, and vicer versa. They know things are going to happen before they do, my two can sense the slightest movement from upstairs and get excited.

I don't think we can really compare us to animals. We've just got completely different makeup

I'm not saying your making anything up, I promise you, I've been very careful to avoid that because I don't believe it. What I'm saying is that you have a belief, and explain your experiences within that belief - nothing wrong with that. I have an alternative belief that isn't comitted either way, so whilst you have the answers becuase of your journey to belief, I am still on that hourney - and don't have the answers - which I'm tryin tp find. I was hoping you and others can help.

No need to be offended, I'm not attacking you or your beliefs Smile

ETA:I find this interesting
I don't think we can really compare us to animals. We've just got completely different makeup
We are animals. This is whyI keep asking this question, because I do not seperate us in terms of biology, physiology and psychology from other animals. Each animal perceives the world differently because their needs mean that their senses develop differently. To bracket every other animal as one, and then set us aside based on our differences in world perception, doens' make a lot of sense to me.
For instance, bats cannot see - so their ears are amongst the best hearting in the animals kingdom. Sharks can smell one drop of blood from a mile away. Do all these other animals have the ability to experience entities. in your opinion? .. end of ETA

If it helps, I'll tell you a bit of background, which may explain how I feel...

I have taken hallucogenic mushrooms a few times, a lot of years ago.
On each occassion it was an absolutely incredible and positive experience.

I was able to hear insects in the grass, I could see the life energy travelling through trees, from base to leaves, like flow of water, but insode the tree.

I have seen the wind circulationg around the wings of birds, and heard their heart beats.

I only allowed these experiences to happen in nature, because I wanted to understand more about the world I inhabit.

I can safely say that without these experiences, it's unlikley that I would be doing what I do now.

I felt like a veil had been lifted - a filter, that enabled me to see information that I couldn't normally see.
In human terms, I explained the reason for this as quite simply that if we were able to see that amount of informatioin all the time, we could never get anything done, we would all be stood in absolute awe and wonder at the world. If we were less intelligent, and had no perception of mortality or ego, then this may not be such a bad thing Smile

In scientific terms, I explained this as a chemical reaction to psilocybin, the active ingredient in said mushrooms, that had distorted my percetion of the world.

Given that we prescribe drugs, like anti depressants, that create chemical changes in the brain to produce an altered perception of the world, I am more inclined to believe the latter - but am very grateful for the experineces I had.

Saying this, because I want to demonstrate that I'm not adverse to everything you are talking about - I have seen things I shoudl never have seen, but I can explain those experinces in science. That doesn't mean that this is the sole explaination, but that it is one that I am able to comprehend., because itis based in research and peer lead science.

Guys. I'm out now for the rest of the day, hope to pick this up later, interesting talk Smile


Last edited by Jay on Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:04 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by dizzylynn Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:01 pm

This virus must be going to ma brain cos everything just went right over my head lol, might read this again when not so bunged up, think wee bit clearer. As for aggressive, could be fact I am bit fussy headed last few days but dont think any aggression is meant.
Hows wee stewie today.
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Post by Thumper2001 Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:02 pm

I can't answer this. Nor can science thus far, because science can't even decide if these entities even exist or not Laughing

I've never thought about this before and I just drafted a lengthy reply then decided it sounded stupid so deleted it Laughing

Perhaps "they" are only seen/sensed (whatever) when they want to be. And to their target audience only. How "they" would do that, I do not know.

But it would explain why only SOME humans claim to be able to actually see/sense them. I also don't believe EVERY animal can see/sense them. But it certainly seems like animals are more sensitive to "them" than us.

*shrugs* I don't know. I think we could come up with loads of different possibilities but unfortunately we'll never really know Sad
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Post by jolovesbunnies Mon Feb 20, 2012 2:16 pm

I believe 100% in spirits, supernatural and related visiting but I know many people do not and I respect that. As for mediums I think most are probably charlatans and they ruin it for the ones who are genuine. I agree with you Thumper dear, some of us can see them and so can some animals too, but not all.

Hugs

JO xx

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