Thinking of Anne Mc Bride.

Hi Hoppers!
I don't know what to do. Need help any ideas, suggestions and tips are welcome.
You might know that Vernon is peeing outside of the litter tray, mainly on the sofa. First I took him to the vet to get checked. They didn't find anything wrong but gave me Baytrill and metacam to treat a cystitis. 
Back at home I found that Lancelot the Tom cat is weeing in Vernons litter tray. Of course I stopped that but Vernon seems to have forgotten all his (so perfect) litter behaviour and continues to wee on the sofa. He will hold for 8 and more hours but not using his tray which is deep cleaned and refilled. I even managed to sample some of his wee from the sofa(covered with plastic sheet) and put back in his litter tray.
He is very skittish and I feel he is lost doesn't know his boundaries. The cats are banned from the lounge unless I'm around.he is eating again and interacting to some extend.
I try to calm him as much as possible. Changing the sofa cover three times a day. 
Just unsure of what best to do now.
 Anne Mc Bride came to my mind as this is not " normal" bunny behaviour.
HELP! 

Have you thought of putting a new little litter tray on the sofa where he is doing it. I know it's not nice but ghis is how we litter trained daisy. We put a tray where he wanted to pee and then after he was using it there moved it a few inches a day until it was where we want it.

Yes Katie I tried that.
He just pushed the whole tray over and than wheedled on he sofa 

Ahhh thats a problem then....

Perhaps you should drop anne an email?

Do you think that would be ok? I'm just clue less what else to do.
Have you got her e mail address?
I apply all the things you do when litter jtraining. I.e putting a little amount of poo and wee back in after cleaning. Placed various litter trays around the house and put him into his main one a few times a day bribing with treats.
Will phone the vet tomorrow again to see whether I can book with the bunny savvy Bob for him to be seen.
I have not given him more Baytrill or metacam, maybe I should continue with the metacam just in case?

what are you cleaning the sofa with?

My advice is to ban him from the sofa until you can get him back going in the litter tray. The smell of the cat may have lingered so buying anew litter tray may help too.

Im sure she wouldn't mind... she can only say no right? And you never know
- she may be able to help :-) fingers crossed hun.

Also may be worth giving the RWAF a ring? Are you a member? They have a helpline.

Yes I have got their number and will call them tomorrow.

Oh dear, I am sorry to hear this love, yes, I would give Anne a ring. Please keep us informed.

Hugs
JO xx

Has anyone got contact details for Anne?
I'm worried the boy has not pee ll day.
Would you restart antibiotics and metacam?

Amelia66 wrote:what are you cleaning the sofa with?

My advice is to ban him from the sofa until you can get him back going in the litter tray. The smell of the cat may have lingered so buying anew litter tray may help too.

I agree with this. Keep him off the sofa. You need to break the cycle.

Unless you are 100% certain there is no infection I would carry on with the meds. Have you provided a urine sample?

No we haven't taken any samples.but then we didn't know that Lanci was using Vernons tray.
I had a day off today and stayed in the lounge with him, he won't waddle on the sofa whilst someone is sitting on there.
Hence I'm gonna sleep here tonight.
As he has free run of the warren=lounge it will be tricky to keep him off the sofa. He has never been locked in a confined space since being with me and the indoor hutch is nice enough as a hide and bed but not really suitable as primary housing.
He had a small wee about an hour ago after I had placed him in his litter tray which I do very hour or so. I left the wee in there.
I also have restarted on Baytrill and metacam as I think it won't harm and just in case that I deal with two issues it is the safer option.
He is not to bad with the Baytrill and loves metacam big style.
My plan for tomorrow is to call the vet and see who is on.if Bob is on duty I will make an appointment or at least talk to them. I have got RWAF helpline number and will phone them too. Maybe they can provide me with Anne's details
He is eating alright and even gave me a nose kiss after his medication. He is just such a sweetheart.

I think you're taking the best course of action possible - treating for both behavioural and medical problems covers all angles then

Please let us know how you get on and if you get a response from Anne McBride, let us know what she says.

Sending hugs - I know how wearing it can be when bunnies decide that they no longer want to use their litter trays!

Get well vibes on their way love.

Hugs
JO xx

Ok here is the update.
Went to work for a few hours and had removed the throw from the sofa leaving the plastic cover on. On my return he had wheedled onto it, so bingo, I had a urine sample.
Took it to the vet. physical examination did not show anything. Urine sample checked, all clear. Bob said to finish the course of Baytrill but it is sure now that it is a behaviour issue.
Discussed options:
Moving Vernon into the other spare bedroom? I don't like this one because it would mean he would be lonely up there. But for the 
Sat resort ok, I would have to get him bonded to a bunny girl. Means I will need to check with my landlord and OH is not keen o have a fourth bun.
OH said just try another attempt on bonding with Bertie and Bubbles so they can share the warre. Certainly enough space there, but by the way they act I can't see this happening.
Keep him in the lounge but avoid him going onto the sofa and the cats to enter his space ie litter tray hutch and hid outs. May be possible by getting or designing a close litter tray that only he can access. I got some run around pipe left that could be used to link litter tray with run. Lancelot may not be able to squeeze through as he is a big boy.
Also to re arrange the lounge by moving furniture around to confuse him and pretend he is in a new environment and hope he is taking back to use his litter tray.

Phoned RWAF and spoke to Ros. Anne is off work after being poorly for some time. 

What do you all make of this?

Get some pen pannels and put them around the sofa to keep him off but not confine him. He wont be able to widdle on there so should go back to his tray.

Make sure the sofa is cleaned with bio washing powder or an enzyme cleaner to completely remove the smell.

Also possibly a new litter tray, or more than one/he has now to give him a few more options

they are the only other things i can think of that may help

I used an enzyme cleaner, but not sure whether it had soaked into the cushions. It is one spot only that he uses. So for tonight I put his cage base there and see wht happens. 
I thought of putting my puppy pen up but know he will jump that easily, see him doing it in the past. He has got Belgian hare in him and very powerful hint legs!
Just been searching. The sofa is old and Bubbles had chewed various parts of it. It will need replacing at one point. Thinking of an armchair as the other part(L shaped) is fairly intact.
What material except plastic would be good?

I think keeping him in the living room is a good plan, and perhaps moving things around a little. I know its hard but keep on with putting him in his tray when he has peed. Try soaking the wee from the sofa up on a tissue and popping it into his tray - this might help him get the idea that its his tray where the wee should be. What sort of litter are you using? Is there a good layer of hay on top?

Its good news that there is nothing medically wrong with the little monkey!


They are such complicated creatures arnt they!

Do the RWAF have any other behaviour experts they can call on.

I am glad you are getting somewhere hun and are able to take steps to stopping him from doing this. I too am very glad that is is OK though, I am just sorry t is extra work for you love.

Hugs
Jo xx

:-(((((
He had wheedled on the other part of the corner sofa when I got back from work.
Will try to clean it and put a protective plastic cover on.
It looks like he will be rehomed in his own space.
Spoken to OH again.
Seeing this makes me cry and I would not get him in the spare bedroom on his own, as  he has never been there! and Oh agrees now ( not having any space in the lounge to sit down on) maybe we need to open a second warren?!,
The spare bedroom needs rabbit proofing and of course we need to get him bonded with a "lady" ?!

Good luck with that love, I hope you find him a smashing wife

Hugs
JO xx

I'm sorry he's having to come out of the lounge, but I'm sure he and his wifey bun will have a fabulous time in their new warren together!

Good luck with your search - please keep us updated!!

Here you go. 
I had phoned Furry friends last night and spoken to Emma. After explaining all and her asking precise questions,we found that Vernon is completely stressed! 
Her advice was to consider rehoming him ASAP and let him settle in for a few days as you would introduce a new bunny into his place. When successful and using a"new " litter tray open the door and let him roam,without the cats getting to close. 
Then reassess regarding a hunbun for him. 
So I did clear the spare bedroom, moved all his belongings up there. Found an old washing up bowl in my store cupboard that could a good scrub and put my boy in his new warren.
After a few minutes I heard a strange noise so went and checked. My boy is doing Binky's and rabbit flops and is utterly happy and beside himself. Well done Emma for guiding me through that.
He now had 24 hours in there and is back to his gentleman behaviour including litter tray using of 150%.
I will take photos tommorrow and share with you all.
Just so good to see him happy again.:love:

This is great news

I am so glad Vernon is happier - what a relief!

Wow, I so love a happy ending, this is great love.

Hugs
JO xx