Update on George and Gemma

oooo - hes getting you right where he wants you.....he'll be like Lord Daisy in no time.! ha ha ha ha ha

TRUST ME ...HE WILL EAT ANYTHING

OH ...EXCEPT CUCUMBER

My buns always do their poos and wees in their bed! Except when they are outside, then they do them in a special corner.

awww i'm glad George is settling well. I had the pleasure of meeting him for the first leg of his trip and he is a stunning little bunny

Oh thank you Kirsty for taking him to Sooz. I have just read your Archie thread and realised it was a bunny swap. Yes, George is lovely - we just need to get to know each other. Am going to spend some time with him now watching TV and see if he will sit on the settee with me stroking him for a while. I feel a bit more confident now I know that him lying flat doesn't mean he hates me as he always does it.

I will put something yummy on the settee for him to eat which may act as a bribe. He certainly loves his food.

I'm taking my oldest cat to the vet on Wednesday and am going to book George in then for his myxi jab sometime next week. I'll get him weighed too so the vet has something to compare him with when he goes for his VHD jab. I don't want him to get fat. He seems a lot thinner than my outdoor buns but that is probably because they have their winter coats on and seem to have doubled in size since the summer, but most of it is fur, when I stroke them.

The putting George on the sofa wasn't very successful. He started digging. I put him on my lap and he dug in even more earnest - and it hurt!!! He did have a bounce around the lounge but kept going back to his run - I think he feels safer in there.

I checked his litter tray and it is full of bunny droppings - clever George - putting the tray in his box clearly worked!! He had hay in his tray and hay in a box but I put some loose on the rug and he tucked into it. I've never had a bunny who's eaten hay before - it's wonderful and will hopefully keep his teeth healthy.

I did let Tigger in (my only male cat, but a big softy) and George went down his tube into his box, but soon came out again and stayed out after that. Tigger just looked at George and then stretched out on the settee but my cats are all used to bunnies. Hopefully, George will slowly get used to the cats but I am only letting one in the lounge at a time - eight would be a bit overwhelming for the poor bunny. Tigger has been evicted now as I have tucked George in for the night. I do so hope he is happy. I really hated leaving him to go to work. Didn't realise I would worry so much about leaving him on his own.

You sound like such a loving bunny mum!!

I'm sure George is very happy to be with you!

he sounds adorable, and I think you're gonna have a well happy time together
Teaching him 'No' and/or 'leave' is good for housebuns, and will help him learn what the boundries are. They will stop at a sudden noise, we used to say, loudly 'No' then clap our hands twice, if he carried on we'd do it again, and he did learn what he could and coudn't do.

I'm so looking forward to hearing more of his escapades

Mmm - I know it's early days but this house training isn't going too well. When I gave George his breakfast this morning he had urinated in a corner of his run and soaked the rug. It is a different corner to that he used when there was a cushion there. He is doing the droppings in the litter tray though, which thinking about it is exactly what Justin did. Do bunnies need two trays? I think Angie did say George had two with her. I was thinking about maybe getting a covered over cat one that he can use when he is free range. If I use an open one I think my cats will end up using it too whereas they have never had a covered one so would probably leave it alone. When I went to visit Daisy B he had a covered one which is what made me think it could be a good idea for George.

I can see poor George's run full of litter trays at this rate. I've only ever trained kittens and they were so easy. Once they started eating solid food, I put them in their tray, moved their paws in the litter and that was it - not one accident after that.

George also throws his food bowl around to get the pellets spread over the rug. I could use a heavier bowl but he looks so happy doing it, I don't like to spoil his fun. Maybe he prefers having to search for the pellets. Having them all together in a bowl is much too easy

Having a house bunny is so incredibly different to having outdoor buns. So much to learn. Someone recommended a book on here and I am going to order a copy. I think George is settling in OK though, but do feel guilty when I leave him to go to work, although so far I have been working from home more than I have been out in the community.

Thank you all for your support - George and I do appreciate it lots.

Hi Karen,

You shouldnt expect that the litter training is something that happens immediately or easily. It does take time. It took us a fair while moving litter trays around (and moving poo around for that matter) before he completely got the hang of it. what we did was when daisy we'd outisde of his tray we popped the tissue we had wiped it up with into his litter tray. So that the smell was in there. However daisy never used his litter tray to sleep in. He never had food in his litter tray either as I did not want to confuse him.

If he is sleeping and eating in there then I dont think he'd want to wee in there - although I know that some bunnies do.

It was only after we had him used to doing all his business in the tray that we gradually introduced the lid.

I dont expect that george really knows what he is supposed to be doing yet or where he is supposed to be doing it becuase of all the changes he has been through.

If it were me - id pop another small litter tray where he is wee'ing - or even a pile of the litter so that he associates the litter with poos and wees.

We were always very careful to use the same type of litter so that he knew that litter = place to do his business. Then gradually you can change the place he is doing it. If you dont use litter then perhaps newspaper - just so long as its something he will recognise as a wee or poo place.

I think its important to get the basics down with him first before trying something new. It all just takes a little bit of time. Id def start with a second little tray or somthing first.

Daisy throws his food about all the time - he thinks its fun....id leave him to it - will keep him busy!

all of that ^^ is sound advice. Give him time to settle, to make your home his too, and don't expect too much too soon. Putting a tray where he goes is usually best, and house buns do tend to need more than 1 tray. Bertie has 3 dotted around.

As for it being incredible different, it is in the short term, while you learn how to adapt both your appraoch and your environment to suit him. It can take a while, but the rewards are lovely at the other end

Do you think it would help new housebunny owners like yourself, if we produced an article for the 'Rabbit care articles' section on adapting to having a house bunny?

Thanks Katie and Jay

Have just got in from work and George is sleeping in his litter tray in his box. I will definitely get another tray and put it in the corner where he is urinating. I have been putting the droppings in the run into his litter tray but will start putting the wet kitchen roll too so he gets the idea.

I just feel mean because he is confined to a playpen when I am out but I don't want to give him free range until he has got a better idea about his litter trays or I will have to spend ages searching corners of the house for mess. Having said that, when I do take him out of the pen and let him run around the lounge when I am watching TV he has a quick explore and then goes back to the run. He can't get in by himself so I lift him in.

Maybe that is a big enough space for him for the short term. It has a big box in there with his litter tray in and outside he has a blanket and his food, pile of hay and toys so he does have space to bounce. I just hate seeing bunnies caged, but I'm probably more concerned than George is. He actually seems quite laid-back and happy flopped out in his litter tray.

He has only been here a day and a half so I think I am expecting too much too soon. He is certainly enjoying his food. Ate some cabbage this morning and most of the pellets he threw around have disappeared too.

I think an article in adapting to a house bunny would be fantastic. I am amazed at how different I have found it rescuing an indoor bun to rescuing an outdoor one. With an outdoor one I am so much more confident, but I guess I've had 20 years of outdoor bunnies - I've only had a couple of weeks with an indoor one and Justin was poorly so it was very different with him. He just stayed in his pen until I was home and then sat on my lap quietly until he got bored and I put him back in his pen.

George is a really inquisitive bun - it is lovely to see. He stands upright a lot just looking around. He is getting used to my voice now I think and maybe starting to know his name. I was pleased with how he didn't seem too bothered by Tigger last night once the initial shock was over.

Don't worry, I'm sure he'll be fine It's better to gradually increase his available space, so that he can scent it and get used to each space at a time. The delight when an inquisitive bun discovers a new space is wonderful! Although he's indoors, he's still acting on prey instincts, and if he suddenly has too much unknown space, he'll probably wee everywhere and then hide in some very difficult to get at place The amount of times I thought Bertie had died, or flung himself off the balcony, bacuse we couldn't find him anywhere was not funny! Most of the time he was squished under a chair or under the bed

I have been out to an evening class and when I got back George had messed everywhere in his run. It was covered in droppings and urine. Although I have a rug down it has gone under it and soaked my floorboards and gone down the gap between them too. His tray has a few droppings in but not many

I have cleared it up and asked him very nicely if he can try to use the tray tomorrow. I didn't catch him toiletting in the wrong place so there is nothing I can do. I will get another tray tomorrow and see if that will help.

He seems to be getting messier with each passing hour. It would be easier if I didn't work as I could catch him doing it in the wrong place and correct him but retiring is not an option sadly.

Apart from that, he is settling in really well and is eating whatever I give him, has started playing with his box full of hay and is happy for me to stroke him.

It's just as well I like a challenge! He seems to be producing an awful lot of droppings too for just one bunny, but they are round and perfectly formed

Will go and say goodnight to him shortly and give him a cuddle. He really does have the most adorable little face.

Rhianna, don't stress or panic. These things can take time. It's all about trial and error. I went through at least 3 litter set ups with Brynn before her habits were perfected and then again went through different things with Hippo and Brynn being together.

If it's any consolation I'll tell you about my litter fiasco with Hippo and maybe it will give you some ideas, or at the least bit some hope.

Before I got Hippo I had been told he had immaculate litter habits. The first day or so that he was here he seemed to be pretty good. As each day went on he started to get worse and worse. At that time I assumed it was because he could smell Brynn and was marking his area. Soon after when they were bonded I had 2 litter trays in their big cage. Brynn remained consistent with her litter habits but Hippo pooped EVERYWHERE on the bottom level! He also frequently left droppings outside of the cage. The worst of it though, was the fact that he urinated quite a bit outside of the litter box. I assumed all of these would get better with time.

The territorial droppings (the ones out side of his cage) stopped within a few weeks. Unfortunately, inside the cage was another story. I had to throw out the mat that was inside the cage as it had been urinated on too many times. I bought a big sheet of vinyl and put it on the bottom of the cage. It was slippery so they buns didn't particularly like it but it made it much easier for me to clean up. It seemed every day he would pick a different joint of the cage to urinate on. Also, he started to poop and pee wherever his hay was. I had to start only feeding them hay in the litter box... but then he would sit on the outside of the litterbox, eat the hay, and do his business . It was getting really frustrating!

Like I said before, it is all about trial and error: I tried moving the litter boxes around, I tried adding more, I tried taking all but one away, I tried putting extra hay in it, I tried everything I could possibly think of... Each time I seemed to get a little bit closer.

I finally went out a bought a large container with very high sides. I now use that as my litter box instead of the shallow one he used to have. They have to JUMP to get into it, but it means that Hippo can't sit on the outside and eat the hay... therefore he HAS to "go" inside. All in all it has been a huge success. There are still occasional droppings near the litter box but not enough to stress over. He still will strategically urinate (on the joints of the cage) but this is only 1 time every 2 or 3 weeks... so I can live with that too. He never does anything outside of the cage (unless he gets really excited and a raisin slips out accidentally hahaha ).

Be patient and keep trying new things. He is likely trying to mark everything he can right now, but you should take that as a compliment because that means he wants it to be HIS home . Like the others have said, try to limit his area for the first little while.

You'll figure it out... it just might take a little bit of time! (Hippo's situation took a few months) Don't get discouraged!

Thanks ElleyMay. I think I am getting stressed because I think it's me doing something wrong as George was good with his litter tray at rescue and I don't want to let George down. George has had such a rough time I want him to be happy and settled and he doesn't seem to like it when I clean his mess up with the dustpan - I guess he sees it that I am invading his territory.

If he is marking everywhere because he wants to make his home, that makes me feel a lot better because it must mean he is happy and has decided that this is an OK place to be.

He does spend time in his litter tray - sleeping! He seems to like the tube/box set up now but spends most of his time flopped out on the rug. He likes me stroking him but really struggles if I pick him up and gave me a nasty scratch just now. I need to be able to hold him for vet visits and bum checks in the summer. He did settle down when I spoke quietly to him and eventually snuggled into my dressing gown. He probably wasn't handled much before he went to rescue.

I was intending taking George for his myxi jab next week but worry that will unsettle him again. Am taking one of my cats to the vet shortly so will chat to the vet about it.

I am so looking forward to the nicer weather so I can put George in the garden and watch him run and run. I think he will love it - he may not have had much space to binky in his last home. Only a few months to go!! I've told him about the garden and he seems interested.

He is fantastic with his food - wish my other buns were as easy to please. He just eats anything I give him and seems to really enjoy it. He eats hay too.

I've volunteered at rescue and my main job is a mental health worker so I do enjoy a challenge and have lots of patience. I am more frustrated with myself than George. He's just being a bunny and needs me to guide him.

Dpnt be disheartened. I think like elleymay said - that he is maybe marking his territory. Have you tried a second tray yet?

No but have a gap between clients this afternoon so am off to PAH. Have just got back from the vet with Mogling and booked George in for his myxi next week.

I was worried in case his previous owners had already had him vaccinated
(which is unlikely given that they abandoned him) but the vet has reassured me that if that was the case and George reacted to the injection he can do something about it. The risk of not doing the myxi and VHD is much higher than the risk of him reacting against it. My vet is a relatively new one to me but seems brilliant with my bunnies so I am happy to trust his judgement.

It will be good to get George registered there and weighed so I can keep an eye on his weight given the amount he seems to devour. He doesn't seem chubby at all at the moment but I want to keep an eye on it.

The vet said to have the VHD three weeks after the myxi which is great as it can come out of a different month's salary.

Just wanted to say it is totally normal for litter training to go to pot for a few weeks after a move to a new home so it's nothing you are doing wrong. It will take him some time to decide where he wants to go, think of it as us rearranging our furniture on moving into a new home. Once he finds somewhere he is happy with it will get better and better as he settles in.

That makes sense Sooz, thank you. Have just popped home to check on him and he is flopped down on the rug, having eaten all his food and veg and lots of his hay. None of my other bunnies eat that much, but then I would worry if he wasn't eating.

I guess as long as I keep topping the hay up he will be OK until I feed him again at tea-time. My outdoor buns only get fed twice a day but I have been giving George food when I check on him which I can see is a bad habit to get into. I don't want an obese bun. He just eats so voraciously whereas my other buns pick at their food and veg throughout the day.

It is lovely to see a bun enjoy his food so much - a bit like me - I love my food too.

Hi Rhianna,

I give daisy a small layer of nuggets in the morning and the eve and a bowl of mixed leaves in the morning and the evening....if he is hungry in between times he has to eat his hay because its the best thing for him.

I wonder if George is scoffing becuase he was left to starve...he prob thinks he has to keep eating just in case - poor mite.

K x

Hippo would eat until he actually burst!!! He has no control. He eats things without even checking them out first. He will eat Tori's cat food, his old foster mom caught him eating her pizza when she got up to answer the phone, if I drop anything he is immediately hovering it up... Once outside he even tried to eat an old cigarette but I have to be really careful. He will jump up on anyone/anything to get to food of any kind.

Like Katie said this could be because they were abandoned. Hippo was turned lose onto city streets. He was underweight and starving when he was found .

Luckily, like George, he also loves his hay! When I'm feeling the need to spoil him a little bit I resist the temptation and just add a bit of fresh hay (and his reaction always tells me that he is just as excited with fresh hay as he would be with a luxury treat).

George sounds like such a nice guy! I'm glad you're enjoying him so much! When are we going to get some more pictures?

I think the starvation experience has probably scarred him and made him very aware of food. Like EllieMay says, keep topping up his hay and that will fill him up with healthy food - and keep his teeth nice.

Well, George and I are continuing to get to know each other. I had to work last night but when I got in I put him on the settee with me. He digs straight away and when he is on my lap so it is too painful to hold him. He had a run around the room but was happy to go back to his pen.

We've just had morning cuddles. George didn't struggle quite as much as yesterday and settled down quicker. He even let me give him a couple of kisses. We had a little chat about litter training as his run was littered with drops in every available space today - and nothing in the litter trays.

I popped him back in his run and gave him a treat and he is now tucking into his breakfast. I kept topping his hay up throughout the day yesterday. I've got some new hay from my friend who used to run the rescue I helped out at. She gets it from a farm and it is much cheaper than the pet shop and the hay smells lovely. George was very impressed and is eating even more hay now.

Is it OK to keep topping the hay up? I don't want to give him food throughout the day but he eats up what I give him straight away and I know bunnies have to graze. Is there a limit to the amount of hay he should be having? I've never had a bun enjoy hay so much.

Off to work now but not working this evening so will be able to spend a bit more time with George. Am going to get him some different veg from Angie's list today as well so he has a bit of variety. It's wonderful having a bun who will eat anything. My outdoor buns could learn some lessons from Gorgeous George.

Ahhh - baby steps......